Upgrade Priorities

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BKT
Posts: 211
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2012 3:17 am

Re: Upgrade Priorities

Postby BKT » Sun Mar 03, 2013 2:07 am

Once each power bar cost 25-30 scraps and I have some spare scraps, I'll buy the Lv.2 O2— it's quite convenient. :mrgreen:

I usually don't buy the early Lv.2 Medbay like many people seem to do though since it doesn't have any in-battle use. (for the most part) ... And whenever I did upgrade it in hope for blue option, I never seem to be able to find one... :x

For non-boarder, Lv.3 Sensor is also nice if there's a lot of scraps lying around. ;)
cicobuff
Posts: 62
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:20 pm

Re: Upgrade Priorities

Postby cicobuff » Sun Mar 03, 2013 7:05 am

It depends on the starting ship.

Most ship I will do the following:

1) upgrade shields (eliminate chances of getting destroyed by laser + beam/drone/asteroid)
2) improved weaponry to get through lvl 3 shields or drone defence (depends on starting ship)

Before anything else, the above will guarantee survival beyond stage 3 if I can accomplish them.

Going medbays first is a big gamble as the blue options give extra crew, which you need to put to use with teleporter. And I find that if I go teleporter with the medbay I won't be able to get level 2 shields or drone defence that I need to guarantee survival at stage 3, putting me at mercy of the RNG gods.

Edit: this is for normal mode.
Pepin Short
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 12:22 am

Re: Upgrade Priorities

Postby Pepin Short » Thu Mar 07, 2013 1:21 am

Gentlemen.

Let me rephrase.

I agree that upgrading shields and engines and offensive power is better overall for survival and progress, but in the first sector, at least, there is not much that puts you in too much danger, so you can afford to get some nice things, even if you do not buy the energy to power them.

I have noticed a level 2 medbay pays for itself quite quickly, and this is what I would like to discuss. What systems provide the best return on investment? After reading and playing more, I agree that offensive power is the best investment, BUT not completely necessary in the first sector. The ROI of engines and weapons is not as high (low? "worthy") as say, getting an extra crew this early.

I suspect most people along with myself go through the first sector a few times until a great outcome is obtained.

So the question is, to improve the chances of having a great run through the first sector, is it better to save money for maybe a good weapon or an extra shield, etc., or to spend it early upgrading the med bay, sensors, etc., in the hopes of getting some great blue options?

I think this is the issue.

EDIT: syntax, grammar
Everything is turn-based
BKT
Posts: 211
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2012 3:17 am

Re: Upgrade Priorities

Postby BKT » Thu Mar 07, 2013 2:46 am

I usually save enough scraps (including scraps from anything that I can sell) for what I need the most until I found the shop in that sector, then spent scraps on ship's system that you need once I visited it and after I'm sure that there's no other shop in the next jump! :oops:

There's always an exception though... :roll:
Last edited by BKT on Thu Mar 07, 2013 7:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
cicobuff
Posts: 62
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 12:20 pm

Re: Upgrade Priorities

Postby cicobuff » Thu Mar 07, 2013 7:30 am

BKT wrote:I usually save enough scraps (including scraps from anything that I can sell) for what I need the most until I found the shop in that sector, then spent scraps on ship's system once I visited it and after I'm sure that there's no other shop in the next jump! :oops:

There's always an exception though... :roll:

That is exactly how I do it too. And contrary to what pepin says, I don't find myself restarting at the end of sector one or two at all.

See it this way. If u reroll at the end of sector one often. Your build is probably too dependent on luck.
MC3craze
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2013 3:36 pm

Re: Upgrade Priorities

Postby MC3craze » Thu Mar 07, 2013 1:09 pm

Pepin Short wrote:Gentlemen.

Let me rephrase.

I agree that upgrading shields and engines and offensive power is better overall for survival and progress, but in the first sector, at least, there is not much that puts you in too much danger, so you can afford to get some nice things, even if you do not buy the energy to power them.

I have noticed a level 2 medbay pays for itself quite quickly, and this is what I would like to discuss. What systems provide the best return on investment? After reading and playing more, I agree that offensive power is the best investment, BUT not completely necessary in the first sector. The ROI of engines and weapons is not as high (low? "worthy") as say, getting an extra crew this early.

I suspect most people along with myself go through the first sector a few times until a great outcome is obtained.

So the question is, to improve the chances of having a great run through the first sector, is it better to save money for maybe a good weapon or an extra shield, etc., or to spend it early upgrading the med bay, sensors, etc., in the hopes of getting some great blue options?

I think this is the issue.

EDIT: syntax, grammar


I rarely have trouble finding extra crewmembers. The medbay is normally a late-game or boarding strategy kind of upgrade. There are some ships where getting certain upgrades are more important than others, the mantis B for example; a level 2 teleporter allows you to have a fighting chance against auto-assaults. Where otherwise defeating the ship would be impossible.

One of the best scrap returns is level 2 doors, it helps a lot when you have very little crew or crew that are bad at putting out fires. Another is the great and mighty level 2 shields, allowing you to laugh in the face of puny enemies with basic lasers and a mini-beam; and maybe even level your crew quickly. Early engine upgrades are good too, costing little scrap and allowing that extra 5% dodge that can save you from irritating leto missiles. Even though those early sector enemies are relatively harmless, I spend a lot less scrap on repairs when those shields are up, allowing scrap to be poured into other systems instead of going to waste.

In short, I don't feel comfortable spending money on things that might give me a great benefit. The RNG is not as forgiving as I'd like, especially on normal where there is a lot less wiggle room when it comes to spending early scrap.
greetingsfromoslo
Posts: 77
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2013 11:47 am

Re: Upgrade Priorities

Postby greetingsfromoslo » Fri Mar 08, 2013 6:01 pm

BKT wrote:I usually save enough scraps (including scraps from anything that I can sell) for what I need the most until I found the shop in that sector, then spent scraps on ship's system that you need once I visited it and after I'm sure that there's no other shop in the next jump! :oops:


I do the exact same thing, unless some FYFTL force me to spend scrap.

MC3craze wrote:
Pepin Short wrote:So the question is, to improve the chances of having a great run through the first sector, is it better to save money for maybe a good weapon or an extra shield, etc., or to spend it early upgrading the med bay, sensors, etc., in the hopes of getting some great blue options?


Even though those early sector enemies are relatively harmless, I spend a lot less scrap on repairs when those shields are up, allowing scrap to be poured into other systems instead of going to waste.

In short, I don't feel comfortable spending money on things that might give me a great benefit. The RNG is not as forgiving as I'd like, especially on normal where there is a lot less wiggle room when it comes to spending early scrap.


I divide my game plan into three parts:

1. Economy: How I proceed to accumulate resources.
- loot generation
- damage reduction

2. Survival: How I maintain hull integrity and keep crew members alive.
- damage output
- damage reduction
- life support

3. The Last Stand: I make sure to at least have enough firepower to take down the rebel flagship.

If you assess the plan, you'll see that every part will benefit directly from shields and offensive systems. Other systems are beneficial too, but do not have such a direct impact on the overall goal of the game: to beat it.

Just think about the math of the shields:
Repairs cost 2-3-4 for every hull point, depending on the sector progression. One shield point will from the moment of acquirement reduce your repair costs with 2-3-4 for every single shot it absorbs for the rest of the game. That's an incredibly lucrative investment! On average you take down about forty enemies in a single completed run, and the RNG have outfitted almost every single one of them some kind of beam/laser/ion armament. That's a lot of ships worth of negated damage potential. If we for simplicity say that each ship would inflict one hull damage extra without sufficient shielding, and that you take down an average of five ships per sector, your initial shield point is worth 10+10+15+15+15+20+20+20 = 125 scrap from the start. The second and third shield point costing a total of 50 and 100 scrap respectively to install is also economically sound according to the calculation, even though it's grossly simplified.

Remember that the scrap saved from not repairing comes on top of the loot you are able to accumulate. Shields are in a way a downward or an upward spiral: without, you are suddenly forced to channel funds to repairs rather than improvements and you will lag more and more behind in the cold war against your progressively more advanced adversaries; with, you are able to accumulate resources more quickly and fund various improvements that will make you stay one step ahead of the game. I always get the second shield point by the first sector, and the third by the second or early third sector. Only instances of FYFTL will make me diverge from that game plan.
kilnborn
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2013 7:51 am

Re: Upgrade Priorities

Postby kilnborn » Sat Mar 09, 2013 4:15 am

Seems like upgrade priorities change based on the type of ship you're in.

The key, then, is to identify the upgrades that are universal, rather than ship-specific.

Furthermore, universal upgrades must be item-agnostic, in that if you find another anti-ship mkI and then a beam drone in your first few jumps on the engi-A (or B), you're going to try to factor that into your upgrades.

The consensus, then, is that: There are no universal upgrades.

I, also, prefer engines to shields, in general. Obviously, different ship types will determine this. A boarding ship tends to lack firepower to punch through shields and disable dangerous missile weapons. In such a ship, shields are of less use than dodging. Alternatively, engine upgrades before your pilot and engine guy are upgraded are less effective.

Basically, if you start out a ship with a specific loadout/configuration in mind, you'll work towards those upgrades. When the items required to fulfill your expectations fail to materialize, this is called 'bad luck'.

The only upgrade I universally do is an early medbay. The returns on that 35 scrap are positive. It's not just extra crew (which are vitally important in some ships) but the larger reward on some of the most common events.

Otherwise, go with the flow. I know what I want facing the rebel flagship, and that is: to not take much damage, disable the flagship's ability to deal damage, and to move on to the next phase. Different ships will accomplish this in different ways.

I had a Kestrel that got a pre-ignitor early, so I bought a cloak instead of upgrading my shields. I got lucky with weapons (buying good ones instead of, again, upgrading my shields), and hit up the flagship with 2 dots of shields, 2x burst IIs, a heavy mkI and a halberd beam. Phase 1 and 2 were simply a matter of firing, cloaking, recharging weapons, then firing again. No mess, no fuss, no worries.

Not every ship works that way, and in most cases, hitting up the boss with 2 dots of shields is madness. I did a Zoltan-B with 8 in shields, 8 in engines, no drones, no cloak, no teleporter, and 5 in weapons (ion blast x 3, pike beam). It worked fine, as well. Completely different fight.
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Metzelmax
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Re: Upgrade Priorities

Postby Metzelmax » Sat Mar 09, 2013 8:57 am

Agg Shell wrote:My ideal 1st sector is
-2 shield bubbles
-3 engine power
-1 extra crew
-lvl 2 doors


Pretty much this, depends on ship ofc. If I get a good weapon drop /or see on in a shop, i might skip shields and upgrade weapons... but shields take almost always priority.

I then get the drone control as soon as possible (if I cant get cloak), cause most damage I take in every game comes always from missiles.
Here is the Stuff I made:
ImageImageImageImage
And stuff is always better than no stuff, right?
Neoviper
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Re: Upgrade Priorities

Postby Neoviper » Sun Mar 10, 2013 3:58 am

I feel there are a lot more bad situations prevented by getting shields and engines early than other upgrades. Avoiding damage is a very primary concern for me in the first several sectors. Every laser my shields block or missile the engines let me dodge is another repair I don't have to make, not to mention reducing the chance of a fight going horribly wrong and ending the run. Having another shield bar can be the difference between an incredibly rough fight, or a cakewalk. Other things such as the o2 or medbay, are rarely something I need to upgrade unless there are specific weaknesses of the ship that make it a bit more of an attractive prospect.

Anyway, my order of preference is the second bubble of shielding and a bare minimum of power to maintain at least the weapons, shields, and a point of engines. After getting some more power, I tend to get a point of engines, it's pretty cheap and every bit helps. As well, I like engines because upgrading them will allow your crew to level a bit faster, and I rarely have the patience to farm the skills. Doors are optional in the first two sectors, but by sector three I like to have them. Something like a zoltan or engi ship might require doors a bit earlier though.

After that I tend to buy whatever I feel will be most useful at the moment, although I'll save up for the third shield bubble around sector 4. Don't forget to stockpile enough money to buy a weapon from a store, and to actively look for stores. Aside from buying something at a store, what you get and whether you even get anything at all is entirely up to the rng, so I like to add a little bit more certainty to the mix.

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